The Expert System needs fixed.
Alright. This is long overdue. I set up a little system here, I hope every Moderator and Editor can add a bit and vote Yay or Nay.
This system makes a vote, although you have the final say.
Fizz sums it up for me. Except i do think we should revise the current ones. I vote Yay.
Yay. Everything Ninja said and what DT said below is what I'd say.
I'm actually NAY on this one. I think it's the wrong solution to the right problem. We could strip the point based system, but that doesn't solve the problem of people working toward higher ranks, especially when it's the more powerful ranks like Editor and moderator people are after (that are also much more vague)
- No matter what, Fritjof remains an expert.
- I don't think it would be fair to current experts to strip them of their rank because of other people point grubbing of other users. I think a basic grandfather clause is in order.
- I know it doesn't pertain to experts, but not nominating people to be moderators or editors, then having a mass spree of postings about it. It may not be point driven, but I feel this creates the same problem of creating new positions out of consensus rather than out of necessity or potential.
- I don't think the current deal with experts is so bad now that it warrants a huge reform. I think there needs to be an objective way of selecting people if we decide to go down that path, eliminating biases and conflicts of interest and all. I believe part of the issue is that "hand picked" is extremely vague and not to mention biased in how to handle anything. Yes, I know that putting down a definition will just cause people to strive toward that, but being vague creates more problems in trying to solve one.
- I think the current problem is the fact that we were just hit with a new generation of pokemon, which from past experience, drives up the number of users in the community, especially those new to the game and new to the site.
- We currently have 11/24 active experts. (I went through and checked each person's general log-in activity before answering) and that's just people who have logged in, not necessarily people actually using their expert abilities, so it's likely lower than that.
- Basically, if the answers are suffering in quality, I see it as an issue of quality, not necessarily drive for a rank. If the question are not suffering in quality from people trying to gain higher rankings, then I honestly don't see any problem. Basic game theory. As pokemaster said, it's just a title, and while some simply see it as a means to an end to try and become an editor or something, that's where I think the issue of a more clear pah comes into play.
My two cents is about due, so let's go.
I'm gonna go with Yay. 6,000 is incredibly easy to get these days. It took literally no time at all for Indigo to get it. I'm not saying that the current bunch of experts should lose their position; I just don't feel like 6,000 is big enough of an achievement to warrant editing powers any more. There are 20,000 users+ now - things need to change.
I'm going to say that we need to change the system so that you can no longer get Expert with points, but rather with the community's and a mod's approval. There are plenty of users deserving of editing powers who haven't reached 6,000 yet, and there are also some who get expert by just spamming answers and not really giving as much to the community as they could've (not going to name anyone). As Sam said earlier...
People are too blinded at reaching the 6000 point goal that they forget the whole purpose of this site.
If we remove that, then the entire issue will be resolved. People will hopefully not complain about points as much, and spamming answers won't be the only thing you need to do to get expert.
I also propose making experts for each section as well. Lets say that user123 has over 10,000 points on PokeBase, but nothing on the other sections. He'd very deserving of expert on PokeBase, but not on the other sections. So it may be appropriate to have him as an expert where he is contributing to the site the most and not where he isn't as much. This isn't to say that user123 would misuse those powers; it just doesn't seem appropriate. He should earn them on each section. However this is just my opinion that some people may disagree with, which is completely fine.
I just feel like we don't need any more experts than the amount we have. We shouldn't really be giving out the ability to edit when we don't really need anybody else to do it. Basically my opinion is almost identical to Ninja's, so listen to him.
I hadn't read anyone else's responses while writing this, as to not dilute my raw opinion.
Very, very NAY on this one.
To plant blame on users for breaking rules the website enforces isn't the fault of the user on the bottom line. They broke rules - sure - but we're the ones monitoring and enforcing the rules. If someone manipulates the system to get to an Expert status, that falls on our shoulders for letting it happen.
I don't see anything wrong with having more experts. I understand that there should be a low concentration of power distributed, but editing questions and answers and stuff isn't really "power"...you're just a proofreading buddy.
Plus, to collectively say that we don't need any more experts feels dirty to me. I don't want to be associated with talk like that - many Experts on the site got to where they were for helping people with their questions and contributing in their own way. To take that away from people and to make Expert an appointed position is pretty stuck-up for people volunteering their time to contribute to a database.
A lot of early users got their points in bulk by filling up the then-empty database, so it's not like this hasn't happened before. And honestly, I'm just not a fan of impeachment, sorry to say.
After seeing some of the Nay posts I'm seriously starting to question what I wrote here before.
If users are dedicated enough to reach 6K, even though that's much easier done now than before, they should have a decent enough knowledge on Pokémon to have the title Expert, and with many new users on the site, we could use the extra editing help for grammar etc.
Past that, I believe we should keep giving people Expert when they reach 6K at least, as many of us seem to lay back a bit with the question answering etc after a while, so we should take care of the people who are actually active.
There are people who haven't reached 6K yet but have still worked hard for the points they have, so we could potentially promo those people to Expert as well. Just an idea.
I'll vote Nay on this one.
With so many users, points are now easier to get than ever. People have been getting Expert in less than 3 months. Expert once meant something but now it's just a title that plenty of people have including a user that trolled and was banned for months. People get point hungry and spam vote others to get to this meaningless rank. People have the idea Expert means something when really it doesn't and never did. It is just a sign that a user had answered a crap tonne of questions.
Hand pick experts (this may mean stripping expert from everyone and starting over).
Experts should be picked by mods and I guess editors can have some input.
Users who hit 6000 should keep the ability to edit on Pokebase to keep the questions at a decent standard.
Give Experts access to the approval section of the admin page. Currently editors are being overwhelmed especially due to stupid timezone issues. Give experts + the ability to temporarily lock users from talking on chat.