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I am currently breeding a team for use in ORAS WiFi Doubles based around Mega Heracross, and I was looking for a Tailwind user and a bulky Wish-passing Fairy. Togekiss was the first thing that popped into my mind. Later on in the team, however, I added Talonflame, and noticed the SR weakness they would bring to the team. I was wondering if the wiser choice of a Tailwind user would be Talonflame, then switch my bulky Wish-passing Fairy to Sylveon. If anyone could make suggestions, I would be very grateful. (The rest of my team is in the comments).

EDIT: I'm not able to breed Wish to Sylveon, so it will be a cleric instead.

edited by
[email protected] Heracrossite
Ability: Moxie > Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Bullet Seed
- Rock Blast
- Pin Missile
- Close Combat

[email protected] Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 SDef / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Rock Slide
- Ice Punch/Stealth Rock
- Protect

[email protected] Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 SpA / 232 HP / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Tailwind
- Air Slash
- Wish
- Protect

[email protected] Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 212 SpA / 252 Spe / 40 Atk
Naïve Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Mat Block
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse

[email protected] Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz

The last slot will be a spinner, but I haven't decided which one. Sylveon's planned set is:

[email protected] Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 SDef
Bold Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Heal Bell
- Helping Hand
- Protect/Calm Mind

2 Answers

1 vote
Best answer

Let's go through each team member in depth.


Looks just about solid. One thing that might be cool, though, is to take out Bullet Seed for Swords Dance. What with Greninja's Mat Block, and something I will include later, Heracross will get a myriad of opportunities to set up.


I advise using HP investment, or even Defense, rather than Special Defense. T-tar already gets a SpD boost from sand, and it increases your overall bulk rather than just one stat, but then again, that's just how I roll.
Keep in mind that T-tar's sandstorm will chip away at every one of your team members' health, so you might want to switch that to Unnerve. Oh, and what item would you be using if you ran Stealth Rock on T-tar? Cuz obviously you can't use it when you're running AV. Rocky Helmet might work.


One huge, huge, advantage Togekiss has over other Tailwinders is access to Follow Me. Follow Me is what I was referring to in the analysis for Mega Heracross, as drawing attacks to Togekiss will allow M-Hera to set up. So the changes I recommend are Wish -> Roost and Protect -> Follow Me.


Solid. Only possible change is Dark Pulse -> Scald / Hydro Pump.


I know you're probably going to disagree with this, but I say go for Defensive Talonflame.
Talonflame gets Will-O-Wisp, Tailwind, and Quick Guard. Tailwind boosts Speed which is just good, and Quick Guard protects the next Pokemon from Bullet Punch, opposing Brave Birds, etc. If you don't want another Tailwinder, you might run Bulk Up instead of Tailwind. With obligatory Brave Bird, I think it might actually work well!

Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
Careful Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Atk
-Quick Guard
-Brave Bird


Offensive Sylveon time!
With Tailwind boosting your speed and Quick Guard protecting you from Bullet Punch, Sylveon can run a good offensive set!
Sylveon @ Choice Specs / Life Orb
Ability: Pixilate
Modest Nature
252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 HP
-Hyper Voice
-Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power Ground/Wish/Helping Hand

Hidden Power Ground is preferred in that moveslot, but I understand you're breeding it so it may be difficult to get the right Hidden Power.

Hope I helped!

selected by
Great suggestions! I just need to make some comments:

1) I'll keep Bullet Seed on MHera for now, jus tto see how it holds up. If it doesn't, then I'll go for SD. Bullet Seed helps me surprise Rotom-W and Mega Swampert.

2) Didn't think I could be that dumb with T-Tar XD I had already switched to Rocky Helmet, but I forgot to change it in my write-up.

3) I'll take your Togekiss advice, I forgot about Follow Me.

4) Greninja gets STAB from everything, so I sorta just slapped Dark Pulse into the final moveslot. I'll try Hydro Pump, but I find that two 80% accuracy attacks will end up missing a lot.

5) I'll consider your Talonflame suggestions. I'll probably go hybrid with Roost/Flare Blitz/Brave Bird/Quick Guard with Sharp Beak.

6) Sylveon will probably be ditched in favour of Togekiss, but thanks for the suggetions anyway!

7) Is there a certain Spinner that fits this team (no defoggers)?
Good call, forgot about Swampy. And hybrid Talonflame does sound nice, but yeah, recoil's gonna hurt. As for the Spinner, Hitmontop might suit your fancy. As It's a secret said, Bisharp is really common and Technician Mach Punch hurts. Here's the set:

Hitmontop @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
Adamant Nature
252 HP / 96 Atk / 160 Def
-Rapid Spin
-Mach Punch
-Bullet Punch
-Fake Out

OHKOes Bisharp, 2HKOes Mega T-Tar, OHKOes normal T-Tar.
Alright, Hitmontop will work. But should it run Intimidate > Technician for pseudo-defence for the whole team? I should think Technician would be better, but Intimidate has its uses. And do you know of a quick and easy way to get Bullet Punch/Mach Punch Hitmontop without breeding?
Haha, I was actually considering Intimidate but then you needed too much Attack investment to OHKO Bisharp (I think Adamant, 252 EVs, AND Life Orb is a bit much.) And unfortunately not D: But I'm sure someone on Showdown or the like will have a Tyrogue with Bullet Punch and Mach Punch for trade.
That's ok. I think I can train a Hitmonchan first, teach it Mach Punch and Bullet Punch, then breed another Tyrogue.
Awesome! Make sure the Tyrogue has Steadfast, though, or it'll get Intimidate.
2 votes

I would say Talonflame

Why? Even though it adds to your SR weakness (sorry), it can set up Tailwind before being Taunted. Roost is there to cover that up. Also, I noticed that you run LO + BB and FB which is pretty extreme recoil. There are somethings even Roost can't fix.
This is the Tailwind support set I use and it works well:
Talonflame @ No item
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp
Nature: Jolly
Ability: Gale Wings
-Flare Blitz

As you see, the point here is minimal recoil. And also, 2 fairies on one team means a huge Steel weakness and Bisharp is pretty common. Why not a ground or Fire type?
Infernape @ Life Orb/Choice Band/Focus Sash
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Iron Fist
-Fire Punch
-Thunder Punch
-Close Combat/Mach punch

Acrobatics because Knock Off is one of the most common moves on Bisharp.
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/4 Hp
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Levitate
-Superpower/Steel Wing
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Punch

The sole point of this set is to counter steel and fire types.

Rest of the team

Seems fine. SR over Ice Punch. And instead of 252 Hp, make it 252 Atk/252 Hp/4 Def.

This thing is beast under Tailwind. Just use Arm Thrust instead of Close Combat.

Seems really good. But Mat Block? And rebreed for a Hasty nature one.

No recovery, no life. Sylveon can't do much without recovery.

Hope this helps!
-It's a secret!

edited by
Thanks for the answer, I'll comment my thoughts after you add the in-depth stuff :)

EDIT: Also, I don't think you know exactlt what I meant. Togekiss will be replaced with Sylveon, I'm not gonna have both on the same team XD
Oh :P