Gigalith or Hippowdon for Gen 8 Doubles Sand Team?

Question

I want to make a sand team in Showdown & I need a Pokémon with sand stream. Tyranitar has too much weaknesses for me.Hippowdon has sand force as well as sand stream, so I’m thinking Gigalith has sand stream but if Gigalith dies, I’m at a major disadvantage because Sandoconda’s ability Sand spit is very situational and if Sandacona dies first, I waste a move for sandstorm to set up. Can anyone help me who should have sand stream(also I am playing gen 8 doubles with my friend and my other confirmed Pokémon are Sandaconda, Duraludon, Excadrill, and Hippowdon[even if it doesn’t have sand stream]). Movesets would be nice.

Comments

Are there limits to how many sand streamers you can have? genuine question I'm out of the loop. also, weakness policy Tyranitar with dragon dance is a neat idea I have never thought of...I wonder if it still gets it these days?

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Gastrodon is better if you want a defensive ground Pokemon. It has storm drain, more resistances, and better coverage moves.

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@aetherborn rouge There are no limits on the number of sand stream users.
@ferrari Also, why don't you want to have Sand Stream Tyranitar on your team? It wouldn't hurt to have a backup sand setter in case one Hippo gets KO'ed.

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@sumwum I'm thinking that this idea is certainly one of the dumbest I can conjure up, but Whiscash with Muddy water can get the accuracy drop & with Spark, Whiscash can be a troll.
@Ætherborn Rogue Dragon dance is on the not-a-dragon Tyranitar in gen 8, the generation I'm making this team out of.

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wdym by DDance not-a-dragon Tyranitar? How is Spark able to make Whiscash a troll? Also, Muddy Water has a pretty bad accuracy, with a 15% chance to miss.

Answer 1

Hippowdon is the better choice. Not only does it have better healing other than Rest, (e.g. Slack Off) it also has a better defensive typing in Ground. Also, having a backup Sand Streamer is also great in Tyranitar, and Tyranitar is a great Pokémon overall. A set like this might work:

Hippowdon ( Physically Defensive ) @ Leftovers / Smooth Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- High Horsepower
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock / Whirlwind / Roar
- Yawn / Toxic / Stealth Rock

Stealth Rock is for hazards, and Roar / Whirlwind is to make great use of it by forcing the target to switch. Toxic is for stalling, and Yawn is to threaten switch-ins with Sleep. Slack Off is healing. Earthquake is great STAB, but hits all Pokémon, including yours, so I chose High Horsepower because since most of your Pokémon are weak to Ground a move that hits all Pokémon isn't great. The Rocks set is a lead but can be used anyways.
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Here's a Tyranitar set to do basically the exact same thing, but a bit better because it has Taunt.

Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers / Smooth Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful / Adamant Nature
- Taunt / Heavy Slam
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge / Rock Slide
- Roar

Taunt is to stop hazards on your field, and Stealth Rock is to create hazards. Roar makes use of it, and Stone Edge is just STAB.
> Hippowdon is mostly outclassed by Gastrodon because Gastrodon has Storm Drain, more resistances, and better coverage moves. Tyranitar wants Rock Slide over Stone Edge to hit both opponents and Heavy Slam over Taunt to cover stuff like Whimsicott, Diancie, Tapu Lele, and Nihilego. Sitrus Berry is a better item because Double battles are often too short for Leftovers and Smooth Rock to be effective.

Kick that Whiscash off your team. If you really want Paralysis, use something like Blissey ((DUU)) / Porygon2 (DOU) (don't take my word, I have no idea about if Blissey / Porygon2 is good in Doubles, but being bulky and having recovery is probably nice) or maybe just use Duraludon with Thunder Wave.
Gastrodon is great too, having nice coverage and access to Scald and Muddy Water.
Here's the Smogon set for it.

Gastrodon (M) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 92 SpA / 76 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Recover

Gastrodon holds a miniscule niche in DOU for its ability in Storm Drain, which allows it to redirect strong Water-type moves like Urshifu-R's Surging Strikes and Volcanion's Steam Eruption away from vulnerable teammates. Additionally, its typing and special bulk allow it to switch into strong Fire-type moves, such as Heatran's Eruption, and counterattack with moves such as Earth Power and Ice Beam. However, Gastrodon's typing makes it extremely vulnerable to Rillaboom's Grassy Glide. Additionally, Gastrodon is also fairly passive and has difficulty making a long-term impact on the game. Its effectiveness is also undermined by a lack of physical bulk, which also somewhat neuters its ability to counter physical Water-types that have neutral coverage. Gastrodon works best when paired with Pokemon that can take advantage of its ability to redirect Water-type moves. Diancie can gain some safety to set up Trick Room, while Fire types like Incineroar and Heatran also appreciate Gastrodon's ability to shut down threatening Water-type attackers. However, Gastrodon's 4x weakness to Grassy Glide means that it requires teammates that can switch into Rillaboom like Incineroar and Genesect. All in all, Gastrodon is overall a suboptimal pick that struggles to meaningfully benefit a team more than other options. Its weakness to some of the most potent Pokemon in the metagame means that facing a hard counter is extremely likely, and it doesn't provide enough utility for it to be worth it.

Comments

Hippowdon is mostly outclassed by Gastrodon because Gastrodon has storm drain, more resistances, and better coverage moves. Tyranitar wants rock slide over stone edge to hit both opponents and heavy slam over taunt to cover stuff like Whimsicott, Diancie, Tapu Lele, and Nihilego. Sitrus berry is a better item because double battles are often too short for leftovers and smooth rock to be effective.

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So should i use sand stream hippo or sand force hippo

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sand stream hippo is much better than force

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Also should I have both ttar and hippo with sand stream

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If you want a back-up Sand Streamer use both

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> Hippowdon can be used, with something like high horsepower, stealth rocks, slack off, whirlwind. However, the reality is that Tyranitar is just better at this role of setting sand, rocks, & phasing due to having higher special defense (which is then further boosted due to sandstorm), which means Hippowdon gets left off this viability rankings. Tyranitar also obviously can run more offensive sets, giving it more flexibility.
If a sand team really needed an electric immunity, or was stacking too many fighting or fairy weaks, Hippowdon could maybe be a better fit.

source: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ss-doubles-ou.3718683/
Do you really need an electric immunity or something that isn't weak to fighting and fairy?

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@sumwum Excadrill is weak to fighting(it's a sweeper), Duraludon also to fighting(set up), and If I needed a bird on every single Showdown team(which I do because I like birds) Archeops is weak to Electric.

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I would recommend replacing Duraludon with either Metagross or Genesect. Metagross has better defensive typing and attack, Genesect has better speed, and both have better coverage moves and are not weak to fighting. The best bird Pokemon for sand teams is probably Zapdos (Kantonian form). Having 2 or 3 Pokemon stack one weakness is probably fine for offensive teams.

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I'm new to this but why Zapdos?

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Zapdos is more powerful than most tailwind users and more bulky than most offensive Pokemon. Its offensive typing and heat wave let it cover Pokemon that threaten your team, such as most water Pokemon, Rillaboom, and Genesect.

Answer 2

Tyranitar is the main pillar of sand teams in Doubles OU; its massive Special Defense and strong Attack let it act as the archetype's defensive backbone and take on threats such as Landorus, Naganadel, and Necrozma, while Sand Stream synergizes perfectly with Sand Rush attackers. Tyranitar has many set options to choose from to help it fit better on a team, but struggles to overcome its low Speed and common weaknesses; it also suffers from four-moveslot syndrome. Teammates like Excadrill, Dracozolt, and Dracovish appreciate doubled Speed in the sand, and in return, take down many of Tyranitar's checks, such as Tapu Fini, Urshifu-R, and Diancie. However, these cores struggle against Rillaboom and Ferrothorn, which must be checked elsewhere on the team. Offensive Tailwind setters such as Naganadel and Zapdos are especially beneficial for Tyranitar, as they check Rillaboom, Ferrothorn, and Urshifu-R while bringing another form of speed control to the team to help Tyranitar's middling Speed.

Hippowdon can be used, with something like high horsepower, stealth rocks, slack off, whirlwind. However, the reality is that Tyranitar is just better at this role of setting sand, rocks, & phasing due to having higher special defense (which is then further boosted due to sandstorm), which means Hippowdon gets left off this viability rankings. Tyranitar also obviously can run more offensive sets, giving it more flexibility.
If a sand team really needed an electric immunity, or was stacking too many fighting or fairy weaks, Hippowdon could maybe be a better fit.

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Gigalith is also outclassed because it has less HP and special defense, worse typing, and shallower movepool.

A good Tyrantiar moveset for gen 8 doubles OU would probably look something like this.

Tyranitar @ Sitrus berry
Ability: sand stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant nature
- stealth rock
- rock slide
- heavy slam/crunch
- roar
source

Comments

you should include the choices (in this case Gigalith and Hippowdon), and then add the better options as other optional choices

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The OP asked whether Gigalith or Hippo is a better choice. This answer doesn't answer that question.

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> Hippowdon can be used, with something like high horsepower, stealth rocks, slack off, whirlwind. However, the reality is that Tyranitar is just better at this role of setting sand, rocks, & phasing due to having higher special defense (which is then further boosted due to sandstorm), which means Hippowdon gets left off this viability rankings. Tyranitar also obviously can run more offensive sets, giving it more flexibility.
If a sand team really needed an electric immunity, or was stacking too many fighting or fairy weaks, Hippowdon could maybe be a better fit.

source: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ss-doubles-ou.3718683/
So the answer to that question is neither. Gigalith is also outclassed because it has less HP and special defense, worse typing, and shallower movepool.

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I agree, but you should put this passage in the answer itself.